Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 25, 2009 4:15:55 GMT -5
And I'm using this as a placeholder. [04:59] spies6Ed: You're either a terrible Cit or a great Spy [05:00] spies6Yvette: Because I find you to be moronic and make little to no sense? [05:00] spies6Ed: How am I moronic? [05:00] spies6Yvette: I suppose by existing, if you really cannot tell. [05:00] spies6Ed: Please, answere without attacking me [05:00] spies6Yvette: None of your points make sense. [05:00] spies6Yvette: YOu refuse to listen or read things I post several times. [05:01] spies6Ed: Did you or did not attack two citizens/ [05:01] spies6Ed: ? [05:01] spies6Yvette: Your biggest case against me is "She made a case against someone who was a citizen, aand even though I found the person just as suspicious, SHE'S GUILTY and I'm not!" [05:01] spies6Ed: True, you did [05:01] spies6Yvette: I did not attack two citizens. [05:01] spies6Ed: you did [05:01] spies6Ed: 3 if you include me [05:01] spies6Yvette: No, Ed, for the 75th time tonight, I did not. [05:01] spies6Ed: how not? [05:02] spies6Yvette: I never attacked Robert. [05:02] spies6Ed: explain to me in small, masculine wordes [05:02] spies6Ed: with no e [05:02] spies6Yvette: You lack a brain. [05:02] spies6Ed: Explain [05:02] spies6Yvette: It was a spy trap. [05:02] spies6Ed: What was? [05:03] spies6Yvette: I cannot according to you say "E" [05:03] spies6Yvette: So I am using words without it. [05:04] spies6Ed: ? [05:04] spies6Ed: What was a spy trap? [05:04] spies6Yvette: The cases Robert and I made against one another. [05:04] spies6Yvette: As you will see tomorrow, we did it to both protect ourselves from Imprisonment and to see if a spy would be over-eager to jump on either case. [05:04] spies6Ed: tomorrow? [05:05] spies6Yvette: Yes. Rey told me to post it under the chat log. [05:05] spies6Ed: didn't save Robert either [05:05] spies6Yvette: I asked if I should do it tonight, and he said wait. [05:05] spies6Yvette: No, it did not save Robert. [05:05] spies6Yvette: That does not mean that it did not exist, and more importantly, it proves both cases to be fake. [05:05] spies6Ed: So is Rey a Spy? whats your point? [05:05] spies6Yvette: What are you TALKING about. [05:05] spies6Ed: Me? [05:06] spies6Yvette: Rey is posting the chat log. He wants the log of the original plan conversation UNDER it. [05:06] spies6Yvette: IN what way does that make him a spy? [05:06] spies6Ed: Just trying to figure out where you're coming from [05:06] spies6Yvette: Clearly Earth, which you do not comprehend. [05:06] spies6Ed: Cuz you're all over the place [05:06] spies6Ed: as usual [05:06] spies6Yvette: I'M all over the place? [05:07] spies6Ed: Cal, Robert, Me, anyone who gets in your way.... [05:07] spies6Ed: Khaled [05:07] spies6Ed: soon to be others, im sure [05:07] spies6Yvette: You really just do not listen. [05:07] spies6Ed: Talk to me [05:07] spies6Yvette: I've tried. [05:07] spies6Ed: I'm listening [05:07] spies6Yvette: Do everyone a favor in the future. [05:08] spies6Yvette: Don't play while drunk. [05:08] spies6Ed: Ha [05:08] spies6Yvette: And no, you clearly are not listening. [05:08] spies6Ed: Sober as a gopher here [05:08] spies6Yvette: Otherwise you would understand that Robert was not a suspect. [05:08] spies6Ed: Big case...not a suspect? [05:08] spies6Ed: oh right, fake case [05:08] spies6Yvette: Then let the burg use that against you when they read through the entire group chat tomorrow. [05:08] spies6Yvette: Since you clearly now were faking being drunk. [05:08] spies6Yvette: Goodnight, Ed. [05:09] spies6Ed: later bitch [05:09] spies6Ed: learn how to spell birkenstocks plz Oh, by the way, after tonight you can most certainly bet I will be going through the group chat that Rey posts, and make a case against Ed. Including, but not limited to: The several times he blatantly lies throughout, including suspecting Ariel and I the most from the original group, but later saying he suspected Khaled more than Callahan but didn't have the votes on his side, to later correcting himself and saying that he did suspect Callahan the most, to saying that Ariel and I are not necessarily spies, to calling Ariel a human spy bitch, and my personal favorite, the literally 20+ times he ignores the description of what really happened with Robert. He told me to vote him, and I don't like to be one to disappoint. It's probably going to happen. Thank you, Drunk Ed  |
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Post by Ed on May 25, 2009 4:31:00 GMT -5
Lies? please point out
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Jenya
Jenya
Knew Something Was Off About That Emo Freak...
Posts: 7
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Post by Jenya on May 25, 2009 6:19:53 GMT -5
So your case on Robert, which wasted Tuesday night and most of Wednesday, was fake. And then you used the reactions to the fake cases to catch poor Callahan, a citizen who found the whole fake case thing bizarre. That's really pro-cit there and definitely something to brag about, you guys.
At this point, with eight left from your original team and probably 2-3 spies amongst them, it's almost definite that at least one of Faith, Iris, Ariel and Yvette who knew about the plan, is a spy. The unlikely alternative is that none are and 2-3 of Thor, Ed, Khaled, Mirela are spies.
I look forward to your report on which of Faith, Iris, Ariel, Yvette are the spies who laughed while you put together this plan, laughed while you killed off Callahan for being confused by it, and then laughed when they killed Robert off anyway.
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 25, 2009 12:09:25 GMT -5
Jenya, let me address a few things. Firstly, the case on Robert did not waste any time. It was simultaneously occurring with several other things. We also used neither case to catch Callahan, as it was more-so directed to see if Ed (Whom Robert had been putting pressure on) or Khaled (Whom I had been putting pressure on) would jump on with the idea. Callahan's exile was begun because of his suspicious behavior, his backpedaling, and his unwillingness to post any of his ideas until long after others had weighed in (And even then, he was extremely vague). And, in addition, Callahan actually told me that I should have waited on the case with Robert, but he directly said that Robert's case was absolute rubbish, and that my case had him thinking that Robert could be guilty. He did not take a definitive "Both of these cases suck" stance until long after he had begun to catch heat from our group.
I am not going to argue that nobody involved in that plan was a spy, because I do not know if they are. However, do not come here and mudsling, and certainly don't misinterpret the purpose of the plan. The main purpose, as you will see, was to try and protect Robert and myself from Imprisonment. I also think that it is more likely than not for the following to be true:
1. The spies picked up on this by observing the extremely flimsy and unsupported cases, and realized that Yvette and Robert were protecting each other.
2. The spies wanted to frame Yvette and others, so they Imprisoned Robert (This is WIFOM, anyway, and so is your entire last post, Jenya).
To be honest, I am weary of everyone posting their opinions without reading things. If you want to argue why Callahan was such a citizen, then show me. I still do not see it. And if you want to tell me that I used Callahan's reactions to cases to help get him exiled, then you are not reading the thread that was made about him.
Also, I'm going to PS the following.
PS 1 - Don't call Callahan "poor".
PS 2 - In what way is it definite that one from that group is a spy, over the other four people not in the group?
PS 3 - Robert was, in my opinion, an odd Imprisonment choice. I would have gone with Rey, and I think others agree. The only way that I would have Imprisoned Robert, if I were a spy, is to frame someone. So it would make sense that a spy actually did not know about the case.
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Jenya
Jenya
Knew Something Was Off About That Emo Freak...
Posts: 7
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Post by Jenya on May 25, 2009 13:01:19 GMT -5
Firstly, the case on Robert did not waste any time. It was simultaneously occurring with several other things. We also used neither case to catch Callahan. He did not take a definitive "Both of these cases suck" stance until long after he had begun to catch heat from our group. This was Callahan within hours of your cases being posted: spies6Jenya (3:35:38 PM): I read the Yvette/Robert threads spies6Jenya (3:35:43 PM): The cases are terrible. spies6callahan (3:35:50 PM): lol yes It's obvious from reading the Callahan thread that you used Callahan's reaction to your fake cases to bury him: spies6callahan: you had said you took special care to hide this [17:27] spies6callahan: and then its a weak case [17:27] spies6callahan: so i followed your logic to tell you if secrecy makes your cases better, keep them secret spies6callahan: your case was bad [17:28] spies6callahan: that was the basic idea here spies6callahan: you took care apparently to not let robert know about your hand [17:28] spies6Yvette: If my case was bad, why did you not say "Your case is bad" [17:28] spies6callahan: i did [17:28] spies6Yvette: Or "If you had waited, your case could be better" [17:28] spies6Yvette: This is not what you said. spies6callahan: you kept it secret [17:31] spies6Yvette: Keeping a case secret means I am bluffing? spies6Yvette: In what way am I bluffing anybody? [17:31] spies6callahan: its reflecting a false image spies6callahan: its a bad case! i just wanted to see what others thought spies6Yvette: It turned out moot for you to sit back and observe what other people said so that you could take a direct stance after analyzing opinions? spies6Yvette: Ah, so now you are suspicious of Robert. [17:41] spies6callahan: no [17:41] spies6callahan: just think he's annoying Scum, scum, scum, scum, scum. At least in my eyes. Please let the conversation speak for itself. Callahan was right about EVERYTHING even though he went about expressing it poorly. 1) He thought Robert was a Citizen acting stupid. (He didn't know the stupid was an act.) 2) He thought you were bluffing your case. (You were, it was fake too.) 3) When he saw the bad cases, he wanted to watch and see who else thought they were bad without saying anything, which is exactly what you, Ariel, Robert, Faith and Iris were doing. You should have given him pro-Cit points for that. 4) He thought the Burg would have been better off if you hadn't made this case. (He was right, all it did was screw up everyone's radar and get a Citizen exiled.) Apparently the purpose of The Plan was to save you and Robert from Imprisonment. But what actually happened was you used the fallout from it to exile Callahan without telling Ed, Khaled, Mirela or Thor that Callahan was actually right. Faith, Ariel and Yvette knew Callahan was right, and they exiled him anyway. And Iris let it happen without speaking up. |
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Jenya
Jenya
Knew Something Was Off About That Emo Freak...
Posts: 7
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Post by Jenya on May 25, 2009 13:04:52 GMT -5
In what way is it definite that one from that group is a spy, over the other four people not in the group? So many reasons. Ask Khaled about the math of it. I think you do something like this: There are six two-person spy teams that only include Mirela, Thor, Ed, Khaled. Mirela and Thor Mirela and Ed Mirela and Khaled Thor and Ed Thor and Khaled Ed and Khaled And there are 28 possible two person spy teams in your group. So the odds of NONE being privy to the plan are 6/28. So the odds that one or more of Ariel, Iris, Faith, Yvette is a spy is 22/28 or 79%. It's even worse if you had three spies. And considering that our only confirmed Citizen thought Yvette was a spy and Thor and Khaled were good guys? spies6callahan (5:41:35 PM): yvette is going to eventually own up for what she's doing or keep tearing down the citizens, there is no doubt about that. But you're going to be seen as in her party. spies6callahan (5:42:12 PM): i would hate to see you get trampled by association spies6callahan (5:42:18 PM): because i really don't think you're a spy spies6thor (5:42:25 PM): good to know. spies6Jenya (4:05:40 PM): Khaled, I don't know. Bright but not applying himself fully yet. spies6callahan (4:06:10 PM): i trust him a great deal spies6callahan (4:06:18 PM): for what its worth It is really really likely that you came up with a terrible plan and a spy was in on it. Can you please explain why you trusted Faith, Iris and Ariel enough to bring them in on the secret, knowing that if any one was a spy, your plan would backfire and get you killed? |
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Rey
Rey
Amor del Rey
Posts: 161
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Post by Rey on May 25, 2009 13:23:15 GMT -5
I'm going to have to agree with Jenya on this one.
Callahan was basically exiled due to his reactions on your fake arguments.
Although this is incorrect:
He did say somewhere, (I can't remember where) that he felt Yvette was probably a misguided citizen.
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 25, 2009 13:23:20 GMT -5
First, the plan was not terrible. Stop, you cad.
Secondly, Robert is also a confirmed citizen. He thought I was a citizen. He thought Ariel was a citizen. He was suspicious of Khaled. What does that tell you?
You are examining things from one angle. Callahan trusted Khaled, because Khaled did not jackal him. He liked Khaled, and that's not an actual reason to trust someone.
The plan was actually a wise idea, but it was translucent. More than likely, and as it has already been shown, people picked up on the fact that they were not real cases, and as such, Robert was Imprisoned. In what way is pushing false suspicion on one another when one member of your group agrees to save either of you, should you be exiled, a terrible idea in order to avoid Imprisonment? I keep hearing you say this but have not gotten a reason why the idea itself was bad.
I trusted Faith, Iris, and Ariel enough to bring them in on the plan because, like Robert, they were my top citizen reads from the first few days of interaction. In addition, I knew that Robert being Imprisoned could likely reveal which one from our group, if any, was a spy.
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Post by Ariel on May 25, 2009 13:29:00 GMT -5
The fact that Robert vs. Yvette was fake was not the be-all and end-all of Callahan's exile and I don't see why it's being claimed that it was. The main three reasons Callahan was exiled:
1. He failed to give an original opinion on anyone, even when pressed repeatedly.
2. He consistently backpedaled when confronted (granted, we're talking about fake cases here, but the point is that he thought they were real).
3. Near the end, he began playing people against each other in an attempt to pile votes on Mirela, who he thought would self-vote due to inactivity.
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Rey
Rey
Amor del Rey
Posts: 161
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Post by Rey on May 25, 2009 13:32:08 GMT -5
Original opinion?: Overall I haven't gotten to talk to everyone yet but I'll attempt this anyway. 1. Thor - Our team's local lurker. I don't know where i'd stand on this guy. 2. Khaled - Looks like he does want to play but hasn't yet made his big push. I'll need to talk to him as well. 3. Iris - Seems active and ready to go. I'm leaning citizen thus far. 4. Ariel - Even more active, and winner of a big challenge. I don't mind this, especially since she'll be in the spotlight and if anything happens, everyone would know about it. I hope she's a citizen. 5. Callahan - Me. Citizen. 6. Ed - Seems like a nice guy, hopefully a citizen. He made the effort to chat a bit with me so that shows initiative. 7. Mirela - No idea who this person is. 8. Yvette - A lot of people are concerned about yvette. She's taken a bit of a leadership position, and that makes some people uneasy. However, they fail to realize that on one hand if Yvette were to lead us on a destructive path on purpose, then we'd have ourselves a spy. On the other hand, she's in the most public position possible, and if exiled, we'd get either someone else taking her spot with an equal chance of being spy or citizen, or we'd have chaos which only benefits the spies. Simply, i recommend a wait-and-see with Yvette. There is no reason to exile her simply because she's a leader. 9. Faith - Seems like a nice person, but I haven't spoken to her personally. 10. Robert - Robert and I had a nice chat, I think he's probably citizen based on our small conversation. |
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 25, 2009 13:39:48 GMT -5
Original as in, something that had not been repeatedly stated all over the burg.
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Post by Ed on May 25, 2009 13:40:19 GMT -5
I trusted Faith, Iris, and Ariel enough to bring them in on the plan because, like Robert, they were my top citizen reads from the first few days of interaction. Why did you immediately trust Faith Iris, Ariel and Robert? Was it simply because you liked them while you couldn't stand myself, Khaled, Callahan, and later Thor? Or do you for once have legitimate reasons to justify your actions. Please, surprise me. |
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 25, 2009 14:16:37 GMT -5
Just because you are a waste of life, Ed, does not mean I couldn't stand you four. Also, to clarify, Thor was not around when the plan was thought up, as you will see. And I quite liked Callahan when I first spoke to him.
Reasons why I trusted those four:
Robert - He and I had been talking from the very start of the game, especially during the mini-mafia games, about our views as players. Although it certainly wasn't a friendly chat (in terms of what we said about others), we did not understand how some people could be so bad at playing mafia, and that it almost seemed like some people were playing dumb. Robert did not play dumb, he played quite strong, and while we knew that we came from different places in terms of how we viewed an idea citizen, we immediately had citizen reads on one another. I knew that he and I would be some of the biggest Imprisonment targets to start, and as such, I consulted with him about this plan because people ran around the burg for the first few days screaming "Robert and Yvette are probably going to be Imprisoned first!"
Ariel - At the time, regardless of if I had trusted Ariel, I needed her power to save one person from exile for the plan. However, while many people were quick to say "I don't think a citizen would have tried so hard for that power!" (Robert, coincidentally, being one of them), I argued that a citizen would want that power the most. Aside from this, every single chat I had with Ariel up to the point made her come across as a citizen. She was one of the three leaders of our original group. After all of this, Ariel prevented a spy, Almathea, from being saved - Even at my recommendation (Why all of you who are lambasting me have not brought this up is astonishing, to be honest).
Iris - In order for the plan to go through, we needed at least four total votes. The fourth person who was online was Iris, someone whom I had come to like and lean towards being a citizen after our first few days together. I invited Iris into the chat to discuss it, but she was not at her computer at the time. As such, she came into the chat about halfway through, but was still included in the plan because of this. I will say that if there was a traitor, I would imagine that it is Iris. However, I am still not sold, and do not think that is at all a strong reason to exile someone.
Faith - After I had invited Iris, Faith came online, and I wanted Faith included in the plan. Not only do I think that Faith has lots of untapped potential, I cannot see her being a spy with the way she behaves and how she has voiced her suspicions both in private and in public. At that time, I wanted Faith included because I felt that she had the best chance of probing the other members of our group, to find out how they felt about both of the lynches. It was clear that people, if they truly suspect Robert or myself, or Ariel, would not tell us how they felt. People were wary of Iris. Yet Faith was someone that, at least the impression that I got from everyone in the game at that time, everyone wanted to talk to. I thought Faith would find us information where nobody else could. And above all else, I thought she could be trusted.
That is why those four, and not you, Ed. Not only were you not online, but I found those four to be the most citizen of our group.
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Post by Ed on May 25, 2009 14:20:44 GMT -5
Thank you for your informative and long-winded (shocking!) response.
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Post by Khaled on May 25, 2009 14:21:06 GMT -5
Do you have the chats for this, Yvette, where the plan got formulated?
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 25, 2009 14:41:04 GMT -5
Yes, Khaled. As previously stated, it will be posted after Rey provides the group chat. He asked for me to post it underneath that.
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Jenya
Jenya
Knew Something Was Off About That Emo Freak...
Posts: 7
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Post by Jenya on May 25, 2009 14:50:31 GMT -5
I will say that if there was a traitor, I would imagine that it is Iris. Not only do I think that Faith has lots of untapped potential, I cannot see her being a spy with the way she behaves and how she has voiced her suspicions both in private and in public. Can you please elaborate on why you feel/felt these two things? |
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 25, 2009 16:56:39 GMT -5
Because of the four, Iris is the one that I not only know the least, but also have not gotten a read from since the beginning. I feel that much more distanced from her since the plan, than prior to it.
As far as Faith, you simply need to read her cases on people and her public opinions. When I read them, I get a citizen feel. I feel that she tends to think similarly to me but still has her own independent outtake from that (Sort of like two similar minds reaching their own individual conclusion), and I do not view that as spylike.
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Post by Thor on May 25, 2009 17:01:14 GMT -5
i personally disagree about faith. i have seen her do nothing aside from go along with popular opinions, and give simple sugary opinions on everything that there is not a public opinion on.
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Faith
Faith
Daddy's Dead Princess
Posts: 78
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Post by Faith on May 25, 2009 19:36:43 GMT -5
Like no one can deny that at the beginning of this game Robert and Yvette were totally two of the most outspoken players in the burg. They were getting discussions going, letting their opinions be quickly known and what not.
So like when I signed on and was invited to this chat I didn’t see anything wrong with going with the plan. I did think it was a creative idea to try to protect the two most outspoken players on my team.
I’ll totally be the first to admit I was surprised I was invited into the chat. I felt like I hadn’t been around enough for people to have a good opinion on me. As I’ve said countless times I was not at home the entire first round (at a friend’s place for the week) and couldn’t get on as much as I wanted to do. So yes, I was personally surprised to be invited on the plan.
I’m saying this now my vote on Callahan totally wasn’t because he thought the cases on Robert/Yvette were bad. My reason for voting for him was the fact he wanted to wait for others to post their thoughts before he posted his. It really did sound like to me he was just waiting to jump on the popular opinions of others. At the time that I voted in the afternoon before I had to leave for the day I felt Callahan was the best choice. However...3) When he saw the bad cases, he wanted to watch and see who else thought they were bad without saying anything, which is exactly what you, Ariel, Robert, Faith and Iris were doing. You should have given him pro-Cit points for that.
Also, after this plan was created I later did genuinely start to suspect Robert (the day of exile if people need to know when specifically). I really thought his posts against Jenya were really weird. Especially the first one where all she said was ‘if Callahan was a citizen...’ and immediately Robert thought they were spy partners together. Both Iris/Jenya know I had been suspicious of that and Jenya knows I was looking into a possible Alamathea/Robert connection because of it. So I was really shocked when he was imprisoned.
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Jenya
Jenya
Knew Something Was Off About That Emo Freak...
Posts: 7
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Post by Jenya on May 25, 2009 20:59:42 GMT -5
Can one of you please post the original chat from when you all decided to launch the Robert/Yvette plan last Tuesday/Wednesday? In addition to the group chat from last night?
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Rey
Rey
Amor del Rey
Posts: 161
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Post by Rey on May 25, 2009 21:19:30 GMT -5
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 25, 2009 21:19:51 GMT -5
It is all posted in our group board.
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 25, 2009 21:20:07 GMT -5
Drat, Rey, beating me to it.
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Post by Kirsten on May 26, 2009 8:33:47 GMT -5
I agree with what Jenya has said in this thread. I think the plan was poor. I think you all were too worried with concocting elaborate schemes while an inactive ate the bullet rather than looking for spies and trying to simply outvote the inactive self-votes. I also think there is hypocrisy in how Khaled was attacked for his random.org statement based on "he's denying us valuable information from the voting record" yet this plan subsequently would deny valuable information from the voting record from every single player involved. I think it's poor that this plan was concocted based on the idea of wasting Ariel's power on a possible fake exile of Robert/Yvette, when the power could have been used so much more pro-actively.
The only real benefit that could have resulted from this plan was in gauging the reactions of everyone to your fake cases. That pretty much didn't happen from my recollection. Way too many people were invited to this party to try to keep the information hidden from spies. If you get 5 people involved in something, there's a strong chance a spy is involved in there somewhere. A couple of wayward votes on Robert/Yvette based on half-assed cases seems hardly enough to really make you two "un-imprisonable" at any rate.
However what's done is done. Discussing how much I disagree with it doesn't change that it happened. I think the best thing that can be done is to analyze how people played off of this information. Analyze the 5 involved and how they dealt with the information.
My current read is that Faith is the most suspicious of the elite 5 that were a part of this scheme. I mentioned in the other thread that she took a complete backseat during the discussion, and I agree with Thor's comment on her play in this thread based on what I have seen thus far.
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 26, 2009 12:38:16 GMT -5
I agree with what Jenya has said in this thread. I think the plan was poor. I think you all were too worried with concocting elaborate schemes while an inactive ate the bullet rather than looking for spies and trying to simply outvote the inactive self-votes. I also think there is hypocrisy in how Khaled was attacked for his random.org statement based on "he's denying us valuable information from the voting record" yet this plan subsequently would deny valuable information from the voting record from every single player involved. I think it's poor that this plan was concocted based on the idea of wasting Ariel's power on a possible fake exile of Robert/Yvette, when the power could have been used so much more pro-actively. Disagreed yet again. This is what is bothering me. Everyone here seems to think that the only good thing that can happen at an Exile is a spy leaving. Utterly incorrect. Exiles are extremely useful tools. You can cast suspicion on someone that you believe to be a citizen, even if you are working together. In fact, some of the best moves I have seen since I started playing mafia were two powerful citizens (Who actually had roles) working together, while they publicly tried to get the other exiled on a regular basis. In turn, each lynch they were near the top of the votes, but never sent off. Regardless of what you want to tell me, if the spies legitimately think that you can be exiled, they're not going to Imprison you. It's a waste of a turn. So any private casting of doubt that you can do is only going to help save you in the future. As far as the Khaled situation, I disagree. All of us involved in the plan were willing to offer up our suspects in a proper order, and the only untrue thing about that would be including Robert or my name in the mix. The argument about Khaled was that he had five "equal" suspects and could not pick between them. It is not that he denied us valuable information, that was not the argument. It was that he would deny responsibility for a mislynch. There is a big difference. Also, I find it interesting that you are critiquing us on not trying to find a spy, because unless I'm incorrect, Kirsten, I believe that all Robert and I did for the first 5 days of the game was accumulate as many notations of suspicious behavior as we could, which not only extended outside of our group, but I'm pretty sure was unparalleled by anyone else in the game. But thank you for that wonderful accusation. No. Benefit #1 - Avoid Imprisonment (Did not happen, but is a benefit) Benefit #2 - Observe spy-like reactions to cases (Did happen) Benefit #3 - In the event of failure, potential insight to a possible traitor within the group (Sort of happening now, but with the wrong reasons/intentions/actions) I have to go right now, but I am finishing this up later. |
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Jenya
Jenya
Knew Something Was Off About That Emo Freak...
Posts: 7
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Post by Jenya on May 26, 2009 12:50:25 GMT -5
Benefit #2 - Observe spy-like reactions to cases (Did happen) Benefit #3 - In the event of failure, potential insight to a possible traitor within the group (Sort of happening now, but with the wrong reasons/intentions/actions) Yvette, Ariel, Faith and Iris, I'd like to see your answers to the two questions Yvette posted here. Who (besides Callahan) reacted in a spy-like manner to your fake cases? And who do you suspect is the traitor(s) in the group and why? |
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Yvette
Yvette
Queen of the Byrg-enstocks
Posts: 24
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Post by Yvette on May 26, 2009 14:47:44 GMT -5
[17:54] spies6Yvette: He is right up there with Robert, for me.
[17:55] spies6Yvette: I am still unsure of who I will vote for.
[17:55] spies6thor: robert is definitely near the top. prior to his argument i was uncertain about him, but his entire case against you was flimsy and ridiculous.
[17:56] spies6Yvette: I was surprised at how easy it was to counter.
[17:57] spies6thor: i found nothing in his argument that held any sort of legitimacy outside of omgus.
That was a conversation I had with Thor that made me think he had at least bought into the points I brought against Robert. Correct me if I am wrong. However, the citizen reads I have from private convos with Thor have certainly overridden this.
Still, if he thought that both cases were weak, why did he not address that with me? Why did he assure me that Robert was one of his top suspects, based on Robert's weak case. Why was I not one of his top suspects because of my weak case?
Also, don't ask "Besides Callahan", Jenya, because Callahan did react suspiciously to it. Out of a potential of 5 odd reactions, I saw two. I never saw Khaled's reaction, or Mirela's, and Ed is the only other one that did react. As they say, two out of three, ain't bad.
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Post by Thor on May 26, 2009 18:14:50 GMT -5
i didn't buy into your points for the most part. reading it as someone just entering the game i had it in the back of my mind, and i didn't have the prior experience to think it was ridiculous, but it was solely robert's case on you that had me considering voting for him.
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Post by Ariel on May 26, 2009 21:22:44 GMT -5
Jenya, I can't answer that question. No one came to me specifically because neither case involved me.
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Belle <3